Talk:Isa 14:1-32

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Isa 14:14[edit]

Question posed by Salemlstanley 25 Jan 2006: "I have trouble with verse 14. My understanding of LDS doctrine is that we can ultimately become like our Heavenly Father. This verse however, makes me think that particular ambition unwise. Is this what Isaiah is saying?"

Any help trying to convey the above question on the commentary page would be appreciated. I think my first attempt is not sufficient. Thanks. --MJ 25 Jan 2006

Sorry, I guess my question should be under discussion. I'm still a rookie at this. I do prefer your phrasing of my question though. --Salemlstanley 27 Jan 2006

Salemlstanley, I think this is a very good, thought-provoking question. Far from a definitive answer but here are few of my thoughts:

I think throughout Isaiah there is a theme that basically follows Matt 23:12: "...whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted." The problem is that Lucifer is trying to exalt himself rather than abasing himself, hence God abases rather than exalts him. In trying to become like God, we must abase ourselves by following God's commandments. In contrast, Lucifer's effort and desire to be like God were motivated by a desire for power and glory and did include the humility required to obey God.

Two key words, "heart" and "above" in v. 13 support this view: "For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God." In his heart, Lucifer's motivations were not pure, and his desire to place himself above God is evidence that Lucifer's motivation is rooted in pride.

--RobertC 15:52, 28 Jan 2006 (UTC)

Hi Salem, The point of a wiki is that people will edit and move stuff around to make it better--so no need to appologize. Hopefully it is clear the difference between the question on the commentary page and the question on the discussion page and which belongs where and why. If it isn't clear feel free to post a follow-up question.

Above all, thanks for posting your question as I have enjoyed the resulting discussion.

--Matthew Faulconer 06:45, 29 Jan 2006 (UTC)