Talk:Ether 4:16-19

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Regarding the question:

  • What does the phrase "when ye see these things" mean. To what does "these things" refer?

It seems that "these things" refers to "my revelations ... written by ... John be unfolded in the eyes of all the people." But if these things refers to things being unfolded--what does it mean for the revelations to be unfolded? I first thought that this would mean that the revelations would come to pass but then on reading the next part that didn't make sense. The next part says "when ye see these things, ye shall know that the time is at hand that they shall be made manifest in very deed." That suggests that "unfolding" does not mean "made manifest in very deed." In that case it seems like "unfolding" means someone explaining them. Is that right? What do others think? The current exegesis says

Also in verse 16 Moroni describes that we will find the same general things that were given to us by the book of Revelation in the bible.

I don't see where that comes from. Am I missing something?

Also I have a similar question on this one:

Does this verse suggest that the Brother of Jared may have had foreknowledge of the book of Revelation?

Is there some reason to think that this is suggested? --Matthew Faulconer 23:55, 13 Dec 2005 (UTC)

Could we read "these things" as referring to Moroni's record? Thus, when we receive Moroni's record we will know that the things John saw will shortly come to pass? --RobertC 01:29, 14 Dec 2005 (UTC)

I don't have time right now to update the exegesis but that interpretation makes sense to me.

Regarding the Bro. of Jared and foreknowledge of Revelations, I think the question was asked because of confusion about who's speaking here. If the Bro. of Jared is speaking, the question would make sense. But it seems Moroni is speaking (cf. Ether 3:17), so the question doesn't really make sense. I'd suggest removing it. --RobertC 01:35, 14 Dec 2005 (UTC)

ok. thanks. done. --Matthew Faulconer 13:07, 14 Dec 2005 (UTC)

I love both ideas--that the "unfolding" means that the Revelation of John will be understood prior to the actual event, and the coming forth of the Book of Mormon. Some insights regarding the 7 seals came to me and I wrote them on the discussion page for the Book of Revelation. Christ was the only one worthy to open the seals, because He was the only one worthy to assume the roles depicted in the symbolism John saw. --Janet Lisonbee - Nov. 2, 2008